Broome County Courthouse - Photo by: Aclan (GFDL)
CORRECTION (June 2, 2009): This article contains some inaccuracies. See the discussion thread in the comments below the article for clarification.
Writes CNN.com:
A lone gunman killed at least 12 people and himself Friday in an immigration services center in Binghamton, New York, a government official said.
Why did this happen and how could we have prevented it? The truth is that a police force cannot be everywhere all the time and cannot act quickly enough to prevent a shooting like this from occurring. But an alert and armed citizenry can. If someone at the Binghamton civil association building had been carrying a gun today, he or she might have been able to stop the shooter after he fired his first rounds, saving dozens of lives and wounded.
Unfortunately, Broome County and the State of New York have worked actively to prevent this possibility:
American Handgunner - Jan-Feb 2002:
The New York State constitution makes no mention of the right to keep and bear arms. This causes some people- notably, legislators, police, prosecutors and judges- to conclude that, in New York, there is no right to keep and bear arms and that whatever the state law says, goes.In Broome County, where I reside, unrestricted licenses are almost never issued. The forms provided to you by the sheriff's office contain an application for a "target" license, i.e., a license limited to carrying between your home and the range for target practice.
In Broome County, as in most counties in New York, saving your life or those of your loved ones if violently assaulted outside of the home is not a proper cause to carry a handgun, but enjoying a nice day of shooting at the target range is.
Broome County Resident - March 2005:
[Referring only to a pistol license, not even a carry permit:] In Broome county, you need 4 references who have known you for the past 3 years and also live in Broome county for the background check. If you've lived in Broome county for less than 3 years (eg, me), you need an additional 3 notarized references from people who lived near where you used to live and have known you for three years. And of course, family members do no count. I suppose I could use some friends from college, but I'd have to find 7 people total (unless the second rule preempts the first rule... just how exactly can you get references from the same county who've known you for 3 years if you haven't lived there for that long?). And even though I'm getting a federal DoD background check for work, I still need to get these references.
NRA - 2006:
The media and Attorney General Eric Holder are likely to spin this story as cause for more restrictive gun laws, but it is precisely the opposite that New York State and Broome County residents need in order to keep themselves safe and have the legal means of defending themselves and the innocent lives of those around them from shootings like today's massacre in Binghamton.
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20 comments:
IF one person had been carrying a concealed weapon..The death toll would be lesser than what it is!..Contact the legislature and DEMAND the Rights of the people of NY be restored to defend themselves!..
I like your attitude. You are absolutely correct that complaining isn't enough. We need to be activists. We need to talk to our legislators and make sure they understand that less restrictive carry laws make citizens safer.
Your information is out of date. Broome County has a new Judge now that is allowing people to obtain full carry permits if they are willing to take an approved safety course. If you reside within the county you may want to call up the Sheriff's Department and ask them for some information regarding this program. It's not as hard to get now as you might think.
When did this Judge start serving? Could you provide me with a name so I can dig up some research on him/her? As I understood it from the sources I quoted above, people could get carry permits, but there are a lot of hoops to jump through- you're saying that has changed and that it's a little more reasonable now?
If you reside in Broome County I would just call the Sheriff's Department and ask them what you need to do to get an unrestricted pistol permit. They will give you the names of the classes that are approved by the court.
After you take an approved class you simply write a letter to Judge Cawley asking for the unrestricted permit. He will want to know why you want the permit, where you intend on carrying and how you intend to secure your firearms when you aren't carrying. My understanding is that he is very reasonable and that almost everyone who has done this has been approved. Those that were denied either failed miserably during the class (i.e: negligent discharge) or couldn't be bothered to write a decent letter ("give it to me, it's my 2nd amendment right!" is probably not the best approach).
I'm in the process of trying to obtain mine. Took one of the classes and wrote my letter. When I find out if I was approved or not I'll come back and let you know how it worked out for me.
Well thanks for letting me know. I'll be sure to make a correction on this article and let folks know via Twitter, maybe publish a correction in May's Webzine (which gets posted to this blog on June 1st).
Do keep me updated on how things work out for you either by commenting on this post or shooting me an e-mail. I sure do appreciate you keeping this blog honest.
No problem. If you are curious how pistol permits work in New York State let me give you a quick overview:
In New York State the County Judge almost always has final say over whether or not you get a permit and whether or not it's restricted or full carry. Law enforcement does the background checks and issues a recommendation to the Judge but the final decision is his alone. There's a handful of counties (NYC and Suffolk) where the police control the whole process but that's the exception and not the rule.
As a consequence of this system you'll find rural counties (Delaware County) that operate on a shall-issue basis (practically everyone who doesn't have a DWI on their record gets a full carry), urban counties that refuse to give carry permits at all (Onondaga County, where Syracuse is) and other counties that operate somewhere in between those extremes.
Here in Broome County, Judge Cawley seems to be running a shall-issue system, provided that you can articulate yourself well enough that he knows you've thought it through and are aware of the responsibility that you seek to assume. The only two people that I've heard who got denied included one person who had an accidental/negligent discharge during the safety class and another person who wrote a really bad letter. That person actually got called into court where Judge Cawley asked him questions trying to give him another shot at it but from what I'm told didn't make a good impression there either.
I will come back and let you know how it worked out for me. I don't know when that will be. I've heard of people who got them within two weeks of writing the letter and others who had to wait two months or more.
Good luck with your blog. If it means anything I'm a "small l" Libertarian. I don't believe in the whole platform but I agree with 75% of it and really think that we need a louder voice for Libertarian ideals in Washington and Albany. The current course that we are on just isn't sustainable and I for one am rather sick of having to choose between stateism (GOP) and Stateism (Democrats).
"In New York State the County Judge almost always has final say over whether or not you get a permit and whether or not it's restricted or full carry." -see that I don't like, but I am glad to hear that Judge Cawley seems to be making the best of it and being fair according to your description.
I would call myself a small "l" libertarian as well (as I am not a registered member of the LP), and honestly I don't know that there is a monolithic "platform" with which I could say I agree entirely or from which I deviate some.
You could say that I agree w/ 75% of "the platform" for example because I am adamantly Pro-Life, and believe that it is not only compatible w/ libertarianism but a necessary corollary to it.
I am glad to hear that you're just as fed up as many Americans are with this whole one party system disguised as a two party system, that keeps delivering us more and more statism.
And I appreciate your best wishes for The Humble Libertarian! Best wishes to you too and good luck w/ the permit.
I don't really like the county-based system either but it's better than the alternative of New York City style laws being imposed upon the whole state. Gotta remember that NY is really two states -- NYC/Albany and the rest of the state.
I'd like to think we could have a nice uniform state standard once the 2nd amendment is incorporated against the states but even then I would fear that the legislators from NYC would find a way to undermine it. Local control is probably the best compromise that ensures the rest of us in Upstate actually have a semblance of our rights. Of course it might be completely unconstitutional (equal protection, what?) but that's a discussion for a different day.
I would register as a Libertarian but for two reasons. 1) In NYS you have to do it as a write-in and lose the ability to vote in the primaries when you do so. 2) I'm a poll worker and would lose my assignment if I'm not a member of the two major parties. I do donate money to the LP of NY though.
Does that county judge hold an elected office? At least that would help a little!
I am not a registered member of any party, and I might remain that way unless I have a specific reason to work within a party (like running for an elected office), in which case I would be open to either the Republican or Libertarian Party.
The process that Judge Cawley has set up works. I know of a lot of people that have taken a class by the guys from Rochester Personal Defense (Theirs was the first class structure OK'd by the judge) for the CCW upgrade. They got training in the use of force, learned how to use their handguns safely, and they shot over 125 rounds on the range! I am going to his July class. All of my friends say that this class should be the model for CCW'ers in Broome....
Does a DWI stop you from getting a restricted carry in Broome County?
If it was a felony DWI you are barred from possessing any firearms. If it was misdemeanor DWI then it's up to the Judge.
In New York State the issuing authority (i.e: County Judge) has full discretion over whether or not you get a permit and what kinds of restrictions are on that permit. I don't know whether or not Cawley would consider a DWI to be a disqualifer. It would probably depend on how long ago it was and what the circumstances were.
You will have to disclose it on the application, possibly write a letter of explanation to go with the application and be prepared to answer questions about it if the Judge wants to call you into court before making a decision.
I know that there is one group training in the area that teaches the correct ways to do things. Look up Rochester Personal Defense at www.safeinrochester.com to see their class. I took it and found it to be great and highly informative
W.E.,
I told you that I'd come back and let you know when/if my concealed carry permit was approved in Broome County.
My CCL was approved in September. Been carrying without issue since then. Our system still sucks (why can't we have shall-issue like the majority of the US?) but at least here in Broome County it is possible to obtain a CCL with a little bit of effort. My friends who live in downstate NYS aren't nearly that lucky.
Keep up the good work! :-)
Hey, thanks for the update and the kind words!
I just finished the class from the folks at RPD, LLC and holy cow! I could not believe the amount of training that they gave us in the day and a half! Although it wasn't cheap (200.00) I would have paid twice as much to get the training and info. I'm letting everyone I know that they have to go to these guys. I actually had a friend go to one of the other 'authorized trainers' but then he found out that their certifications weren't even valid. Those mutts were frauds! No real certification, just a bunch of war stories and standing around. Oh yeah, my buddy shot a whole 22 rounds. (Heck, I shot almost 200!!)
I was wondering how to get a concealed carry permit. This gives me a little bit of an idea. I'll have to do some more research.
Every Individual citizen in this country has the same rights, even if we are not allowed to utilise them under the current social environment.
Almost all the gun control laws in individual states are unconstitutional.
Requiring anyone to be a resident of the county for three years to own a handgun is clear infringement.
It does not allow someone who legally owns handguns to bring them into the state when they move for three years.
No other right, as defined by the bill of rights, requires a permit, license or qualifying set of conditions.
A right is given to all, equally.
I am not even sure that denying felons who have served their time is constitutional.
We need to stand up and loudly demand that our rights be respected.
Case in point; Chenango County, NY. Judge Howie Sullivan is writing law by altering NY State issued permits to carry a concealed weapon! This is way out of his jurisdiction and is just the good old boy network where he grants the right to the rich and the poor can go to hell! I am seeking at attorney to sue this Judge for altering my permit!
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